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Author Topic: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)  (Read 41970 times)

TheGuy

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #30 on: January 22, 2008, 07:17:47 pm »

Now, that people forgot about this thread a bit, I will be able to toss in my opinions.

RPGS- Don't play unless you got time you don't want. You WILL spend most of every game grinding (you just won't realize it.)
The best ones have longer leveling times, giving more of a "YOU ARE THIS STRONG RIGHT NOW, DEAL WITH IT" Kinda thing, and leveling isn't rewarded as much as enemies scale alot. At least that's my opinion, and FF8 sucked because they screwed up horribly with scaling.

And, with the whole JRPG VS WRPG crap, JRPGs have a set storyline, just for the point that its a story to be told (as far as plot goes) and WRPGs are, in a way, a world that you kinda make more choices. It boils down to do you want to be hand-fed a story, or do you want to wander around aimlessly for hours on end till you figure out "OH! STONE GOES IN PEDISTAL!"

Christ... this forum's turning into a /v/.

Also, in b4 tl;dr, rules 1&2, and LOLSHOOTAN > RPG
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dsk

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #31 on: January 22, 2008, 07:20:40 pm »

Personally I HATE long levelling times. I only play private WoW because of that, it takes TOO DAMN MUCH to actually become fun.
I remember a Lineage II server I played once, I got do max lvl in like, 2, 3 weeks, playing and hour or two per day. That was the best server I've ever played and the first time I've actually had fun playing an MMORPG.
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TheGuy

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #32 on: January 22, 2008, 08:06:27 pm »

Personally I HATE long levelling times. I only play private WoW because of that, it takes TOO DAMN MUCH to actually become fun.
I remember a Lineage II server I played once, I got do max lvl in like, 2, 3 weeks, playing and hour or two per day. That was the best server I've ever played and the first time I've actually had fun playing an MMORPG.

MMORPGs are completly different, though leveling times separate noobs from people who actually play, which is why I think that most games need longer lving times (KAL Online's system is quite good. Fast till 20, decent speed till 30, then hellish grind at 40.)

Max Level should take a while, instead of 2-3 hrs of play. I Like this RO server I Play, only 2x, same as sakray, and it has more people that sakray on normally, which is really good. No special NPCs or anything, its a classic server. Also, the WoW server I play is 5x, which is more than good for WoW. Too high of exp rates is boring, same with too low. Maple Story's grind up till 50ish is standable, but after that, it's quite boring. Someone kill me, I have a Lv 70 Hermit and 73 Sader ;.;


And, for games with low level caps, like Guildwars, they just get boring unless you really like to be forced to upgrade only from gear for most of the game. Gear upgrades are more fun if the max lv stuff isn't too low of a lv.

And lastly, games with levels that don't do much (IE, GunZ, Gunster, KartRider (I think) and others) that just unlock gear are fine by me. Normally the upgrades are like going from a 3 hit kill to a 3 hit kill, so it dosen't really make much of a difference. (But the defensive upgrades in GunZ can be annoying. You're extremely squishy with only 115 total HP/AP to start with, and getting that extra 80 or so points lets you take more risks, though the "Pro" Kstylers still always 1-shot you with there Avenger MK II's)
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dsk

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #33 on: January 22, 2008, 09:26:10 pm »

Pang Online has a cool levelling system. You actually don't earn shit from levels, you just are granted with new items to BUY with money you aquire from killing. And also new servers, with higher lvl players, meaning stronger weapons, aimbotters, and more money.
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TheGuy

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #34 on: January 22, 2008, 09:30:39 pm »

Yay for aimbotters. Best kind of hax ever. S' why I like GunZ. You only get hit if you get hit on your screen, and people move faster than most shooters. So most of the time, the bullets are right where you were, and unless you move right at em, you won't get hit. Cept for pros. They close in on you and stunlock you with melee weps, then shoot you once or twice with a shotgun.
(And leveling dosen't earn you anything after lv 50, just makes you worth more XP to others.)
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dsk

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #35 on: January 22, 2008, 09:31:52 pm »

There are invincibility hacks for GunZ
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TheGuy

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #36 on: January 22, 2008, 09:43:54 pm »

And massive/attack spamming. But (Hopefully) it will die down, and I can go back to playing it.
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HardDrive

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #37 on: February 09, 2008, 01:00:59 am »

Sorry to bump an old topic, but I love this particular subject, especially when it comes to game design. I had to register for this.

I grew up playing JRPG's pretty heavily, but also DOS-era DnD-influenced dungeon crawls. Chrono Trigger and Final Fantasy VI, along with the original NES title are some of my favorite games, but I totally agree that JRPG for a long time has been in a very stagnant and hopeless state. There are exceptions, but many of them borrow from other genres more than they represent the current JRPG. But I think a lot of genres have become this way as a result of both a bigger simpler gamer base, and the fact that in many respects gamers in certain genres want little more than new content for the same sort of mechanic. I love the megaman classic series, but the last 5-6 games of it could have never come out and it would have been just the same. Same old disappearing blocks, spikes, abilities, robot masters. No matter how the story ends you know any way you slice it capcom is gonna make another one up until 8. I remember sitting at the NES memorizing stupid block patterns, trying to avoid spikes pointlessly placed right next to ladders, and all of the sadistic stuff that made me really enjoy IWBTG. But I also think these things like the JRPG's are a result more of an attempt to work within the constraints more than to actually produce the most balanced and effective game.

I don't particularly hate 2d platformers or JRPG's for this. I will admit, however that a lot of the percieved depth and strategy of JRPG games is a farce, which may be one of it's biggest selling points, especially considering how weak the storylines have been for a while.
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Kayin

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #38 on: February 09, 2008, 03:05:41 pm »

One thing that saddens me a bit is discussing this stuff with a friend of mine who knows some decent exceptions (the Tales series, Dragon Quarter, And Shin Megami Tensei), but even while the sound interesting, I can't justify commiting 40 hours to this stuff anymore.
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Yonin

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #39 on: February 09, 2008, 03:42:36 pm »

hmm..it sounds like your basing the whole rpg genre with one series.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2008, 02:58:27 pm by Yonin »
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Yima

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #40 on: February 19, 2008, 06:41:15 pm »

I enjoyed games like Secret of Mana, Chrono Trigger and the Final Fantasy series a lot when I was younger (15-20 years old, or thereabouts), but lately I've grown extremely bored with the pseudo story lines that one is forced to sit back and watch in many JRPGs. Novadays I prefer games like Baldur's Gate (with sequel and expansions), that actually has a story worth the commitment.

As for MMORPG:s, my first MMO was Ragnarok Online. I completely loved the game, as I love being able to actualy build a character using stat points and choosing between skills. Besides Ragnarok, World of warcraft is probably the MMO I've spent most time playing. One thing that bothers me with MMORPG:s, which keeps me from playing them anymore, is that they rarely are good games. That is, without the social factor they become a lot less interesting to play. I prefer Diablo II, actually, which has a nice arcade feel to it while still featuring the possiblity to play online with friends.



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Amber

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #41 on: February 21, 2008, 06:06:00 am »

I rather like JRPGS. Then again, my taste is pretty obscure... I've been raised on games like Shin Megami Tensei(Major <3 for a mythology nerd like myself), which I ended up playing with the help of a friend reading the original cart, heh. Also, Earthbound, which I'm not sure even counts as a JRPG, but was perhaps one of the most incredible games of my youth and beyond. Other ones that come to mind are Megami Tensei's little sister and brother, Persona and Digital Devil Saga, Skies of Arcadia, and older SNES rpgs, ESPECIALLY Lufia II, which was incredible. They have enjoyable plotlines, characters I ned to care about dearly, and often inspired some of the thoughts I hold today.

Then again, I can see why people can hate JRPGS: stereotypically, they're long, annoying, and full of extraneous crap that makes little to no sense besides a reason to go somewhere, kill something, come back for your reward, rinse, wash, and repeat. Part of my tolerance are the two facets that I never get angry or bored with anything; one of my favorite games of modern times is called S.T.A.L.K.E.R. Besides being based in the Ukraine, which already was enough to endear itself to me, it's essentially Myst with guns. But, back to RPGs, my tanget was meant to illustrate that I don't tire easily, and I also find very little hard, so it never seems to me as if I'm grinding. Especially if a good story is at stake.

Lately however, most RPG's in general throw plot to the wind and just attempt to wow the audience with cutesy storylines and graphics. There are plenty of exceptions, Mother 3 was absolutely incredible, and literally had me gasp at several points. With pseudo adventure games like Phoenix Wright and other portable 'thinking' games taking up more and more of the story and humour of older JRPG's however, I think they'll need to either return to their roots or risk a gradual decline.

Also, maybe I'm just really naieve/hidden from contact with the outside world, but I don't see where the controversy is. Ya like some, you don't like some, ya like 'em all, or you can't stand 'em. Nobody's going to go nuts over it, right? And now that I've said that, to add my personal gasoline to the pyre, I really hate MMORPGS. =P I talk too much, and always get on the nerves of my team mates, who just log on to kill things. Roleplaying works better on boards and IRC, anyway... Besides, they all cost $ which I have little of.
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Saiai

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #42 on: February 21, 2008, 09:26:17 am »

Yay, someone who actually mostly shares my opinion on this thread. >_>;
Then again, I guess it's pretty obvious that people who are into rapid-death-platformers would have a bias towards rapid-paced games...
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Amber

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #43 on: February 22, 2008, 05:54:24 am »

Hey, don't get me wrong, I love rapid-paced-games, too! =P To be honest though, I'll play pretty much anything. I also hope to unite gamers, rather than divide them... Just so that when a smarter Jack Thompson comes along, we're prepared. Anyway, though, I'm glad our opinions click a lot, although to be honest I love threads like this. =3 I don't get a chance to argue/ramble much IRL so online is my niche.
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Chris S.

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Re: JRPGs! (I think they suck!)
« Reply #44 on: February 24, 2008, 03:17:00 am »

I still don't get the beef with JRPGs.  It seems more like a fad than anything.  I've only heard the JRPG bashing thing within the last year, and it's like it's coming from everywhere.  Knowing the Japanese, they'll probably start emulating and bashing their own games.  This'll pass, and we'll all jump on the next bandwagon: I don't know, maybe Rail-Shooter-Hating, or maybe that's come and gone too.

The only real differences are the divergence from DnD style (which is all good as far as I'm concerned) and the heavy linearization enforced by a strict adherence to plot.  These are two pretty unimportant points, and apply mostly to preference.

It seems more like people are just being petty about JRPGs without ever voicing the actual problem: which is that JRPGs are not "role-playing" games, and shouldn't be called such.  You don't play your own role, you play a predefined role, like in every other genre.  It's just two different ways to level-grind, and the two are only superficially comparable.  So, what the hell is the big deal?  Nothing.  That's what.  Crisis over.

...

I hate rail shooters...
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